In today’s episode of Child Safety Source, we’re speaking with Darlene Haskins!

Our longtime fans know that, during every episode, we sit down with water safety experts that have dedicated their professional lives to helping to keep children safe. Darlene Haskins fits that model like a glove!

As you’ll learn in this video, Haskins is a woman of many talents. In addition to being a Life Saver Pool Fence dealer, she is also a teacher and an ISR swimming instructor.

Here’s her entire interview with Life Saver Pool Fence’s own Eric Lupton:

Learning More About Darlene Haskins

In her own words, Darlene Haskins has a deep passion for water safety:

“This passion really began when I first started working as a lifeguard and swim instructor in high school. I went on to obtain my Early Childhood Education certificate, operated a large in-home preschool, and taught in a variety of facilities, including my favorite, a Montessori school. During this time, I continued to lifeguard and teach swimming at the YMCA. I was asked by several families if there were any ISR instructors in the area – it became apparent that there was a desire for something more than the Mommy and Me classes available. After researching ISR, I applied to become an instructor, was accepted in 2013, and trained in 2014.”

Through ISR, Darlene soon recognized the importance of teaching drowning prevention to as many people as possible. This drove her to obtain her American Red Cross Instructor Certification for Water Safety/Swim and CPR/First Aid/AED Adult and Pediatric. What’s more, she also launched the 501(c)(3) nonprofit Hand in Hand Water Safety Awareness Foundation, with the mission to equip all people with survival swimming skills, and best practices for water safety, to prevent drowning-related accidents.

Looking for More Child Safety Source Interviews?

If you enjoyed our interview with Darlene Haskins, please follow Life Saver Pool Fence on our official Facebook, Instagram and Twitter accounts. Additionally, please take a moment to check out our official YouTube channel. There, you’ll find the entire collection of Child Safety Source video interviews and more.

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Below is a direct transcript of the Child Safety Source interview with Darlene Haskins from October 2nd, 2018:

Episode 48 – Darlene Haskins

Eric Lupton: And like that, like magic, we are live on the Internet. How’s it going?

Darlene Haskins: Am good. How are you?

Eric Lupton: I am fantastic. So I don’t know– so you said you’re not a Raiders fan, but are the Raiders winning? I don’t know anything about football.

Darlene Haskins: I don’t think they are.

Eric Lupton: You don’t know? Is that normal?

Darlene Haskins: Yeah.

Eric Lupton: Okay. Yeah.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. I don’t think they are.

Eric Lupton: Like the Dolphins, I…

Darlene Haskins: They didn’t [inaudible 00:31] pretty bad.

Eric Lupton: Gotcha. I don’t follow any sports except for MMA which I don’t even consider a sport, but I do know that the Dolphins are always terrible that’s the one– not even following football. I’m just confident all the time that the Dolphins suck so, you know are sad sad football team down here. So how’s it going up in North Carolina, did you guys survive the storm all right?

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. We had some flooding a little bit

Eric Lupton: Yeah.

Darlene Haskins: Because I wasn’t really expecting that, but we’re so far in, so I didn’t think we were going to get anything. But one room flooded about four inches.

Eric Lupton: Wow.

Darlene Haskins: So that was not fun because we just replaced the carpet about a month ago.

Eric Lupton: Oh Jesus.

Darlene Haskins: So yeah. I figured we were far enough in that we weren’t going to get any.

Eric Lupton: Right, because you’re pretty far west, right?

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. It’s like a 4 hours from the ocean.

Eric Lupton: Well okay.

Darlene Haskins: And we still got plenty, but we got a lot of rain.

Eric Lupton: Yeah I bet.

Darlene Haskins: And there were some– there were some roads that kind of not collapsed, but it started to come apart.

Eric Lupton: So did it land like directly east of where you were?

Darlene Haskins: It kind of like– well it somewhat bypassed us, it just got us with rain.

Eric Lupton: Okay.

Darlene Haskins: The big part they were like the cities next to us got some pretty good wind, but we didn’t, kind of bypass us on the wind part, but we got the rain.

Eric Lupton: Gotcha. And even that was enough to make you flood.

Darlene Haskins: Yep. Yep.  And we have an older house too so it’s kind of sunk in the ground, so it doesn’t help the foundation and all that.

Eric Lupton: No that usually…

Darlene Haskins: It filled our pool up real nice.

Eric Lupton: Yeah.

Darlene Haskins: We had– we had to actually dump the pool a little bit, so that we could take the rain in.

Eric Lupton: Wow. Do you guys have any like rivers or canals or anything nearby that contribute to that, or it was just all rain?

Darlene Haskins: Nope just rain.

Eric Lupton: Wow, that’s impressive. Yeah. I live a few minutes away from the ocean so whenever there’s a hurricane, it’s you know, which is probably 2,3 times a year for me, that in Florida, you know we’re right here in hurricane alley. It’s always a concern that there’s going to be flooding and lose a roof again. I lost a roof in hurricane Francis, maybe I forget which one it was, Ivan whatever.  One of them took my roof off and I’ve had anyone ever since but it’s all right. Yeah, hurricanes man they’re– you know I will take hurricanes over what you did in California though. I’ll take a, you know once a year hurricane over earthquakes and fires and you know all the stuff that you…

Darlene Haskins: California is always on fire, always on fire. She’s is so hot, it’s dry heat.

Eric Lupton: Right.

Darlene Haskins: Everything’s dead. I was surprised when we moved here, we didn’t need a sprinkler in our yard. Okay…

Eric Lupton: You don’t need a sprinkler?

Darlene Haskins: In California– in California it’s all dry and you have to have sprinklers, and yeah and here look and it was like it– here you just it’s moisture and stuff, so the grass is always green. You don’t need a sprinkler.

Eric Lupton: Wow.

Darlene Haskins: In California it looked like, hey, if you didn’t have the sprinkler…

Eric Lupton: Yes. I mean I mean I’m in Florida it’s pretty humid here, the same thing though if you don’t have sprinklers your grass dies.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. It was pretty [inaudible] very, we could get up to like 120 degrees in California and dry heat.

Eric Lupton: Wow. And you were in Northern California?

Darlene Haskins: mm-hm. Northern California.

Eric Lupton: So do you…?

Darlene Haskins: I was born in right outside of Stockton and then we moved up towards my mom’s side Stockton, Modesto, Tracy, Sacramento.

Eric Lupton: Yep.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. I’ve been all up and down {unclear}

Eric Lupton: I only know California geography because of life saver pool fence dealers. So my idea of California is directly connected to where we have a dealer. So we have somebody in Sacramento, so I know that– I know we’ve got somebody in San Jose and so I know he’s like Southwest to him kind of. And then we’ve got somebody in Bakersfield and Fresno, so that’s up you know little south of them. And then obviously Los Angeles and then Mr. John Ford in San Diego, he’s down there, so, so, yeah. But my whole California geography is based on where dealers are, if you don’t deal there I don’t know it exists that’s it’s off my map, yeah.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. Yeah. We were northern. I remember when we were– I was little– when I was like 12, my parents use– my parents were separated and they would actually send me on Greyhound to go visit the other one. Like, I would go on the bus back in the day, when you can stick your kid on the bus and send them off.

Eric Lupton: Could you imagine do that to your kid now?

Darlene Haskins: Huh?

Eric Lupton: Could you imagine do that for your kid now? No?

Darlene Haskins: No, no. I wouldn’t even probably put my 17-year-old on the bus, but yeah. But I did it, but we went– I went from South California or so I learned, southern to northern, went through Sacramento, had a layover and then got to my mom’s.

Eric Lupton: And you do that without a cell phone?

Darlene Haskins: Without a cell phone yeah, we use cell phones.

Eric Lupton: Right. So I mean that means if you got in trouble you couldn’t even use a cell phone to call for help?

Darlene Haskins: No.

Eric Lupton: Right. That’s crazy isn’t it?

Darlene Haskins: We had to fend for ourselves back then.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. At 12 years old?

 Darlene Haskins: Yeah. And I think now if you do– if you do send a kid on a bus, I think they have to have like a paid chaperone or something.

Eric Lupton: Wow. I used to ride my chair to school in the middle school, and it wasn’t close, like I mean it was– it was within five miles but you know I was still riding five miles it my chair to school with each day and back. I was– and now I can’t imagine seeing a 11-year-old in a wheelchair on Congress Avenue, you know on the way to middle school.  I just– it doesn’t seem likely you know, yeah.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. My mom said she’s– if she was raising kids today she would probably been arrested already, things she allowed us to do. She used to tell us to ride though, or go on the railroad tracks, follow them to the store and get milk and come back. We would actually buy her milk and cigarettes and come back following the railroad tracks, and I would never do that now. Like I– yeah, totally different time.

Eric Lupton: And then the things that weren’t safe back then, right? You know you wouldn’t tell your kids never to get in a car with strangers right? But now you think it’s much stranger or much more dangerous for your kid to drive, than for her to get into a car with a stranger on an uber app right? You think its way safer for her to use an uber to get from A to B than for her to go out with her friends and have her 16-year-old friend drive, right?

Darlene Haskins: Right.

Eric Lupton: You know if you– did you ever think there would be a time where you’d be like, you know what, I think it’s safer for my 16-year-old to get into a car with a stranger and have them drive her?

Darlene Haskins: No. There’s a lot of things that are definitely weird these days.

Eric Lupton: But now it is, right?

Darlene Haskins: Now well I actually pick up– I do ubering on my lunch…

Eric Lupton: That’s cool.

Darlene Haskins: So I actually pick up a kid that’s [inaudible07:32] on lunch, so.

Eric Lupton: So you use a consistent route every day?

Darlene Haskins: Yep. Parent– well the parent doesn’t hire me as uber, she just knows I’m uber. So she knows that I’m cleared, and you know everything you have to do to go through Uber to be a driver. She knows I am an uber driver, she just hires me on the side and pays me cash through PayPal or you know keep pays me through PayPal. So, but yeah I go pick them up. Because I don’t think you’re allowed to like– the school doesn’t allow uber to come pick you up in middle school like they can, so they kind of regulate it a little bit. So, so she just found me on a mom’s group and everybody was like, “oh Miss Darlene does uber you got to call her.”

Eric Lupton: What made you decide to do uber?

Darlene Haskins: Extra income on the off-season because I’m out of the water. In the summer I’m in the water about 10 hours a day like all day, and now I have about 4 hours lunch break so I was like well while I’m running errands and stuff, I’ll just uber. So it brings in some extra cash, so.

Eric Lupton: I always thought it’d be fun, like I always wanted to do it not for the extra money necessarily. I just thought it’d be cool to do, I don’t know I’m weird but.

Darlene Haskins: I’ve met some very interesting people and I haven’t met any bad crowd. People are like, “oh you got to be your– you know be very careful, you need to buy a gun or buy a [inaudible 08:51] or something,” and I haven’t had any issues not not one. They’re very interesting like they’ll talk about their background and I’ll learn all kinds of stuff about them, take them to the airport.

Eric Lupton: And for you I have a friend who is a business consultant. I think he spoke at the conference you went to ‘Don the idea guy’, you know ‘Don the idea guy’?

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. Okay.

Eric Lupton: ‘Don the idea guy’ is an uber driver and he uses it to promote his business. So he’s got on the back of the chair that they’re you know the back of his chariot, so the chair they’re looking at he’s got a little brochure holder. And he’s got like ideas up or whatever in business cards back there and you know people will…

Darlene Haskins: That’s actually a good idea. I have a rap on my car which definitely advertises, but I didn’t think about the back of the seat. I definitely should get that.

Eric Lupton: Yeah so he kind of you know bring– its there so people bring it up like, what do you do? And you know he gives his little spiel and you know most people don’t own businesses they they can hire him, but some do but a lot of people have kids and a lot of people have pools. So I think, you know that’d be a good idea for you.

Darlene Haskins: Yep. Yep. I definitely– it’s almost every single person that gets in my car talks about the rap so it always comes up, and then I usually give out a card and I’ve gotten clients from that which is pretty cool.

Eric Lupton: So there you go. I mean you’re making money off uber but you’re probably even better you’re advertising, the ISR.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. Well and like people when people say anything about that like not doing it because it could be dangerous, there’s a lot of things I mean if I just– like when I went to Africa, people not everybody, but I had some comments well, “why you going to Africa? You got to be really safe you know you shouldn’t be going”. I’m like if I live my life scared I would never do anything.

Eric Lupton: Right. And in the Africa we see in movies it’s not real life Africa, right? I mean we see all these, I’ve seen anyways a lot of these African kind of PSA videos where they show, you know this is the Africa we see on TV and then this is real Africa. And it looks like New York in LA in Sacramento, you know the big cities and you know modern infrastructure, and you know all the stuff you’d expect in a first world country. So, so why did you go to Africa?

Darlene Haskins: We started a global dual outreach, so I had actually started originally I had started a Facebook group. So it was like for just education and I intended it to just be like our community and my families and people I was teaching, and I was just wanting to get information out. And when I talk to people I get so much information all at once and I kind of just [inaudible11:30] them. So it’s just too much and people aren’t taking it in, so I was like well maybe I’ll start a group and then just post education little tips here and there here and there. So then it’s just gradually in there and that’s not just bombarded, and people were sharing with their friends out of State some out of a country. So it ended up being a global page which I wasn’t expecting and so that was kind of weird, so I just kind of have gone with the flow. So somebody contacted me from Africa and asked us to come help with their swim program and I was just like that’s okay. Well if I have the money we can raise it then we’ll go and I really wasn’t expecting to raise the money and we did, which was cool. So we went and taught 109 adults and 300 children.

Eric Lupton: Out of curiosity for anybody else who’s doing a nonprofit right now, how do you raise the money?

Darlene Haskins: I just asked.

Eric Lupton: Oh. Okay.

Darlene Haskins: When I was– I didn’t actually know what I was doing so I didn’t have the foundation yet, so I just asked some parents. So I just said, “hey I want to go to Africa and if you guys want to help me”, and like 2 months before the deadline all the money just came in,  it was pretty cool. So it was just personal donations, paid for the flight paid for everything. But we taught 109 adults and 300 children which was really cool. I would say only about 5% were comfortable in the water and could swim-ish. Everybody else had no idea about buoyancy, breath control, any, like nothing, because they don’t really swim. Where I was at they don’t really swim recreationally, so they just yeah so they just don’t have a lot of experience in the water. So like they just had actually where we were near Tanzania, they had a ferry capsized. And I had like 700 people in it and almost all of them had died because of sheer lack of swim skills for one, but the boat the 13:30 ferry was over capacity which is common there. They don’t really have the regulations to keep it in place, there was just a suggested capacity, so it was overloaded for sure. And that’s happened many many many times, but people could be surviving these things if they could swim, so it’s really sad. And when I’ve talked to Nathan I think he said, [inaudible 13:56] with– he was on your show with the International Water Safety Foundation.

Eric Lupton: He’s awesome yeah.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah I love him and I love his energy. I’ve talked to him on [inaudible14:05] time.  He was very very pleased to see that we brought, we actually brought one back. We brought Jimmy back and he stayed for 6 months and learned water safety and CPR lifeguarding. So he’s back in Uganda now and he’s working with the Uganda Life Saving Federation to get trainings out. So he’s got skills that he can share with them now and I don’t have to go back over there and train, because I brought somebody here and shared my stuff, so it’s pretty cool. The only thing I didn’t share was the infants because that’s what ISR– there’s all kinds of regulations on that. So he learned American Red Cross which was pretty cool, and he had blast. He actually played for our soccer team while he was here, which was pretty cool.

Eric Lupton: Nice. How long was he here for?

Darlene Haskins: 6 months.

Eric Lupton: Wow that’s a long time.

Darlene Haskins: So yeah. We kind of adopted him, but he was he was…

Eric Lupton: I saw he used your last name on Facebook now, right?

Darlene Haskins: Yes. People kept asking me about that, he wanted an American name.

Eric Lupton: Okay. I don’t– when I saw his name was like I’m just thinking his name isn’t Jimmy either by the way.

Darlene Haskins: No it’s Jimmy.

Eric Lupton: Is it really?

Darlene Haskins: So his name’s Waswa Jimmy, because Jimmy’s his name in his middle name. A lot of them there have American middle name. So like there’s a [inaudible 15:27] if I’m saying that right – Joseph. And then Francis was one of them, but they like, they have different, like I can’t even say his name Sh…I want to say Sudoku but it’s not right. A lot of their names start with double S’s. In that area that we were at where they speak like Swahili so they, depending on their tribe they’re [inaudible 15:51] by their tribe. So, but they have usually a first name and then like an American name and then their last name, which is pretty cool.

Eric Lupton: Do they do that deliberately, so?

Darlene Haskins: I’m not sure. I’m I don’t know I don’t know what the story is with that, but a lot of them have like George William [inaudible 16:13], I can’t even say half of the names. But his name is George. I go by George and then there’s Justin but they all have African names, like that’s just their middle name it’s really, yeah.

Eric Lupton:  I know I thought it was kind of like I’m wrong apparently. I know in China and other Asian countries in school they pick an American name to use and if they come in contact with Americans for business or in life they have this American name that they use. You know you know it’s like a fake name essentially, because they know we can’t pronounce their names. So you know I deal with a Bob and Mike, there was an Eric at one point you know and I’m like, I know your name’s not really Bob like I’m really sure about that, you know.

Darlene Haskins: But this is actually on his birth certificate, his passport, it’s his middle name, so yeah. So we call him Jimmy because a lot of people can’t pronounce the Waswa. So his name is Waswa and then his last name is Insalah. It’s hard to say but we just call him Jimmy and everybody loved him, the families love him, the kids loved him, he did it. So we– what we did was we brought him and when he learned everything, he also did an outreach for us. So in the summer we did a summer outreach for people that can’t afford the regular lessons that are 7 and up, they could learn to swim and float and jump in and dive and get toys and just be water safe. So they had like a two-week training and if they wanted to sign up for 2 more weeks they could and a lot of them ended up signing up for four and six weeks. And they ended up really loving Jimmy so it was a good good program. So we had an outreach here which helped our our community and then he went back and now he’s helping his community.

Eric Lupton: And how old is he?

Darlene Haskins: He’s 18. Yeah. So that that’s, so that’s why we called it the Global Dual Outreach because we’re helping both us and them, so.

Eric Lupton: And how is he selected from?

Darlene Haskins: He was actually one of the ones that we kept in contact with and so he was he was one of the ones that just kept contacting us and kept in communication. A lot of the other ones kind of fell back a little bit. And then I had 5 that we had selected to come and 4 got denied their visas. It’s very very hard to get the visa to come to America.

Eric Lupton: Probably harder now than it was probably at one point.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah and I think he got in right at the cut-offs like something’s going on government-wise, so he got in before they did. They tried about a month later and they were all denied which really sucks because they pay all the money, they travel into the town to do the embassy interview, they do all the process it’s about 300 bucks I’d say, get a hotel or motel, get a you know a suit to look nice, you know transport is not easy, so. And I feel like where they came from they had to ride a ferry, it’s a ferry and drive into town like 2 hours.

Eric Lupton: Plus the emotional investment and you know.

Darlene Haskins: And they all got the night except for Jimmy so that’s actually why he was the only one that got to come. So now we have an application process and they’ve actually those four are on our applications, so if they want to try again they can but I don’t know if it’s going to work or not. But they’re out all that money from the first one so they’re not eager to go and pay it all again.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. They’ve already tried and failed, yeah.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah because money is a little tight there and they don’t make I guess they all kind of think we’re wealthy here, which not all of us are wealthy but they just kind of see America as wealthy.

Eric Lupton:  Well and there’s relative wealth too so you know.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. So they make about and I’ve tried to like talk to them and like figure out how that works, but they don’t make more than like 10 a day or something 5 a day, so they live on unlimited resources. But when you’re there you realize that it’s not that bad because they, all their stuff is cheaper like the food is cheaper and their transports cheaper and everything. The only thing that’s weird that’s not cheaper is electronics, like if you get a cell phone it’s exactly the same price or more than it is here, or a TV or something, anything electronic is is our prices which…

Eric Lupton: Because they’re imported?

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. So, but but food is good and I really like the way that they eat fresh fruit, fresh meats, I love that. And I love their community – Phil – they’re very community oriented. I really really like that. I miss Africa I wouldn’t mind and go back. I’m actually supposed to be going to South Africa next year and that I might I might make a trip up the Uganda again, we’ll see.

Eric Lupton: Why South Africa?

Darlene Haskins: Durban South Africa is the world drowning conference in 2019, in October probably, so making plans to attend that. Tony Torre Jia I think that’s how you say his name on a Canada, he wants me to speak specifically about the Global Dual Outreach, but that’s a big conference so I’m not sure if I’m gonna do it. But but he’s been a big resource, Tony and all the different organizations. I was actually going to tell you I think Kerry had talked to you last week about parents preventing childhood drowning group that just came up. So they want me to make a mention it, because like when I started with the water safety and and training and all that, and learning more and more and being shocked like everybody else, like drowning is the number one cause of death, how is this even possible? I didn’t know, and then all the layers I never knew any of this. I was in aquatics for 20-plus-years on the side, like I did I did teaching, I did early childhood education, grant writing, open to daycare, stuff like that. But on the side I would go to the local city pool or whatever and I would lifeguard and swim lessons for like a couple hours. So I was always kind of like a hobby, I just liked it just for fun. And what I never knew ever, but this was an issue until I got into ISR a journey prevention and that [inaudible 22:36] everything’s rolled since there. But I’ve learned through like Abbey’s Hope, Collin’s Hope, Jack Helping Memorial Foundation, because of Braden looked like Jake all these ones you always hear about on Facebook you know so I just pulled information pull safely all these different…

Eric Lupton: All of the the families united to prevent drowning groups essentially?

Darlene Haskins: Yes. Essentially yeah, and then that one, but pool safely, yeah Josh order all those things. So I pooled all this information together and then when we talked about bringing together that we actually with Nicole Hughes being on CBS, and the Taz Show and all that, with Levi’s legacy, we band together, her and three four organizations started the– and I’m one of them for Hand in Hand Water Safety, started parents preventing childhood drowning. So we’re trying to bring the whole nationwide together as parents, and organizations, and individuals, just have one unified message about drowning and prevention and water safety and stuff like that. So we have one brochure that can go across the United States, one one message, one thing of layers, and there’s gaps. So what I essentially see out of it is there’s gaps, like I have my hand in hand water safety here, it hits maybe a hundred miles I guess, and then those ‘Live Like Jake’ in Florida and it hits there’re in all these different groups, hit their little areas. But we don’t have– we’re missing areas so like in North Carolina we’re missing a big chunk it’s not getting any information. So with this program and this this group going on, we can feel that gap. So people in different areas can get these pamphlets and get this information out not having to start an organization or do all this stuff, they just can order it and bring it in and and get it out there. So I think that’s going to help educate the community more.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. And hopefully you know you guys can you know take lessons from you know the national organizations that exist already you know, there’s there’s pros and cons to them you know. There’s obviously the National Giant French and Alliance out there. They’ve been doing great work for you know almost 20 years now now. They’ve got their big conference every year, it’s going to be in New Orleans this time, I might go to that. There’s Water Safety USA which is learning from exactly what you’re saying about staying on message; their whole thing is once a year. They pick a message and then all of their member organizations which include pool safely [inaudible 25:17] safety commission, American Red Cross, the Boy Scouts, the National Parks and Rec, a bunch of other ones, you know they pick one thing – I think last year was learn to swim – I forget what it is this year. It it might still be that [inaudible 25:31] do it this year. They pick one thing and they try and you know make sure that all of the organizations are you know on message. You’ve got families excited obviously so excited to prevent drowning which is you know Josh the Otter, and Collin’s Hope and Abbey’s Hope, and just gets over drowning; and all the other you know Family Foundation’s to started after they lost somebody who kind of banded together to make a you know one national organization you know. So you need those things you know they’re they’re important. So I’m sure that you know there are friends to prevent drowning who you know will join the fold and I’m sure it’ll be awesome you know.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. Yeah. I just– we just need like I don’t know how else to reach them I guess with Richard Kaufman, he’s got a good idea; he’s just like it needs to be marketed like a business which makes sense, because why do we care about water safety? I can’t believe I said, I mean I am still shocked that it’s the number one cause of death and I didn’t know it. And it’s shocking to me that everybody I tell almost every single person I tell, is like no, that’s not that’s not right, like it’s actually, yeah. It’s just it’s not out there, there’s not commercials on it, apparently there was a commercial one commercial on Super Bowl.

Eric Lupton: Yeah there was for the insurance company.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. I heard it was not a good…

Eric Lupton: No I liked it. Your audio just cut out by the way, you’re back, you’re good.

Darlene Haskins: Okay. I didn’t hear a lot of good feedback on it.

Eric Lupton: I don’t know they they had, you should go watch it. They had a website that went with it and…

Darlene Haskins: I saw the video and I can see where– what was the good part that you thought?

Eric Lupton: I’d have to see it again. But I remember thinking you know it’s at least for you know the Super Bowl, this is better than we’ve had before.

Darlene Haskins: And I’ve never seen one before, so it’s good.

Eric Lupton: And I especially remember liking the website behind it that had the information on it you know. I thought I thought this site they made was really good and…

Darlene Haskins: I didn’t actually see that part of it I just saw the commercial.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. So I went to the site they were advertising and it was really well done you know, so.

Darlene Haskins: Okay. I think that it’s a commercial would have had education in it, it would have been better because then the parents would have got something educational out of it, but it was just a boy talking about all the things he’s not going to do because he drowned. That’s all it did, it didn’t say this is the layers you can take to you know protect your child you know, supervision.

Eric Lupton: Well but as you said you know most people don’t know that drowning is the number one accident killer of kids between one and four. So you know if you– have you start with that the fact that people aren’t even aware, right, and you know you’ve got 30 seconds to make that point you know, do you have time to you know go through laser protection? Maybe, but maybe more importantly is make sure people leave that 30-second gap when they’re eating nachos, they’re telling their friends to bring them another beer and you know, that maybe they get a piece of that. And they you know they they leave at least with that message you know, enough to go check out the website where they can you know get information, and you know.

Darlene Haskins: So the link I saw with the video, I didn’t see any additional website so have to go back and look at that.

Eric Lupton: Yeah [inaudible 28:46] the insurance company actually, which is terrible but…

Darlene Haskins: Nationwide I believe.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. So if you go to the nationwide pool safety water safety page they did a really good job [inaudible 28:55]

Darlene Haskins: And that was in 2015 and there hasn’t been one since.

Eric Lupton: Right. And the other commercials that used to air not really Super Bowl were those pool safely ads.

Darlene Haskins: I haven’t seen them since they were on TV.

Eric Lupton: I think they aired on TV some– yeah back when they…

Darlene Haskins: I’ve seen some on on Facebook.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. Those are great, those videos are amazing. Those may be the best pool safety videos and I include my own of that that we have I’m a big fan of my my animated one you know, yeah.

Darlene Haskins: Yours yours is by far the best one I’ve seen.

Eric Lupton: Oh well thank you. Yeah.

Darlene Haskins: The one that just tell, it’s so informational so informational and it’s eye-catching, and you watch the whole thing it’s not too long it’s– I share that all the time.

Eric Lupton: It’s not scary which was hard it’s hard to do you know. I didn’t want to make it scary you know yeah and…

Darlene Haskins: It was really good and actually I had put a poll online about, because you’re on their video it says something about pool pool fences and guns, like what could kill your kid, what’s more dangerous and that more kids get hurt by pools than guns.

Eric Lupton: Not just more a hundred times more yeah.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. So that was very it was very the whole thing was just– I liked that video the best out of any videos I see, so I share that a lot. But when I put the poll online about what would you rather if a person had a gun or a pool at their house, which house would you let them go to? And almost everybody said they would let them go to the pool and not the house with the gun. And I was just like but and they’re like, but guns are more dangerous. But most of the time they’re put up and out of the way, the pool is right there and accessible so, and attractive to kids, they’re going to try to get in it. Most of the time you’re not going to be able to access a gun.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. And we even said you know if your kid gets a gun, right, and it’s loaded, and pulls the trigger, where the bullet goes is uncertain, right. But if a toddler crawls into the backyard and falls in the pool only one thing happens, right, there’s only one result to that occurrence. So yeah, that stat came from the a book called Freakonomics which has a bunch of like interesting statistics you might not expect and they had a whole chapter on that, and I thought that was really cool, way back in 2007 I think maybe. But a great book too by the way, but I have it’s really interesting, but but yeah. So that’s that came from there and I’ve used it you know all the time and unfortunately since guns are become part of our political debate, people see that part of the video and it gets clouded you know, but you know yeah. I’ve been really– I’ve been using that video since we made it in 2014, and it still holds up it seems like you know still you know I don’t…

Darlene Haskins: I post it quite a bit. I actually posted it to– I linked it to that poll so people could see it after they made their vote, so yeah. So but another thing I tell people is, or what are the comments actually on that poll was, “they would let their kid go if they could swim, if they can swim there’s no problem”. And I was like well there’s other factors; they could jump you know they could fall and bust their head and you know or they could, there’s something. I mean you still don’t want them to go with you know swimming skills. The other thing was if your kids swimming how do you know someone’s not going to like you know hold them like taking care and they you know. I had a mom call me and say that she needed her 10 year old in the swim lessons because he almost drowned, and he almost drowned his friend was who was a good swimmer because he panicked, and hung onto him, and drag them both down. So you could be a good swimmer all you want, but if you’re stuck on somebody who was panicking, you’re not going to, yeah you’re probably not going to have a good result there. But she didn’t want him in lessons or she’s just never thought about it, because they don’t have a pool, they don’t go to the water, they don’t go on vacations with pools, like nothing like they’re not aquatic people. Because she never put him in lessons, she never realized that that was you know going to be an issue until the family called and said your kid almost drowned my kid and she’s like okay I need to get him lessons. But and so there’s all kinds of things you have to think about with that, just because your kid can swim doesn’t mean you should let them go swim at a neighbor’s pool, and then how much water is around. You saw people that don’t come to lessons because well I don’t have a pool so they like that lady I don’t have a pool, or we don’t go a lot whatever. So I’m going to say about that, there’s always going to be a time when you need lessons – I’m totally blanking – what I was going to say on that.

Eric Lupton: No but we’re talking about how most parents don’t realize you know the severity of the issue and you know you’ve been surprised and the you should be doing it. I mean you know I started doing this 20 years ago, and I figured by now for sure we would you know people would be aware of it, right. If I if I’ve been beating this drum for 20 years you know apparently I’ve been doing a bad job because it still is, nobody knows.

Darlene Haskins: One of my friends from the gym that I I teach out of was an ISR instructor in the 80s in Ohio, and she gave me – and I have it somewhere – but she gave me her handbook from her training from ISR, it was really awesome that in most of like 99% of the information was exactly what I was taught. So the the training hasn’t changed much at all which is really good. The other thing that I learned that I I wasn’t very happy about was that 25 30 years ago the drowning statistics was still the number one cause. I was just like okay, why aren’t we making it back? This is this isn’t good.

Eric Lupton: So when I first started, well when I first started in 1989 and I took over in 2002, drowning was the number one cause of death in a lot of States: Florida, Arizona, Texas, California; but was the number two nationwide, and the second to car accidents. Now it’s number one nationwide also, it’s gotten worse or I think car accidents got better actually but still, you know.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. And I I don’t know if it’s– I don’t know, here we’re and I know like in different areas parents do different things and one of– here we have a ton of puddle jumpers, just it’s convenient to stick your kid in the puddle jumper and you’re on the side of the pool watching. And you a lot of these parents think that they’re going to hear for an example, we saw a mom and it’s common to see, well we saw big a kid that was like three four, and she’s in a puddle jumper and she’s swimming all over the pool, and I was looking at her through the window after like in between lessons; and I just seen her swimming all over and I looked to kind of see you know who’s the parent and you couldn’t attach a parent like I was like who’s actually, like no one’s looking at her. So I watched her for about two minutes and she went from like the middle of the pool through under the little line to go to the deep end and went towards the deep end, was the swimming in the deep end, still nobody. I was just like, okay; and then I see a lady from like the stairs on the way other side of the pool stand up and look over the edge, and like look and then get back down. So it was her mom. I’m like so that’s not effective supervision yeah. I mean it was like two minutes close, but she even before she’s even looked, so if she would have fallen out of it or anything could have happened, and I know I sound like I’m over crazy about it but that’s just…

Eric Lupton: No, you’re the appropriate amount you know.

Darlene Haskins: A ton of stuff could happen with that like that’s not, it’s not okay. And so that’s one problem.

Eric Lupton: Your kid is swimming in a death trap you know, you should be watching them, you know.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. But they the parents just think that those are safe, they’re safety there, that’s just, and they’re convenient. They don’t have to be right there holding them because I can’t swim, like if they can’t swim they should be in the kiddy pool with two feet deep, and you should stand right there with them or in the splash pad. But if they can’t touch and they can’t swim and they shouldn’t be in the deep pool that’s just– unless you’re going to be in there with them [inaudible 37:18]

Eric Lupton: Right and there should be lessons, yeah.

Darlene Haskins: Swimming lessons or helping them get, you know teaching them stuff or whatever, but they shouldn’t just be floating around in the little floaty. But we had gone live about that, well not about that, but it came up with puddle jumpers and a lady from that Rebecca where Robinson is in the UK, had commented – can’t remember her name Debbie I think it was – and she said that she want to know what a puddle jumper was. So we had showed her a picture and she’s like, “oh we don’t have those at all here”, like they just don’t have them, I’m like oh, so it’s just an America thing or, and actually I don’t see those a lot anywhere but America, so I think it maybe is.

Eric Lupton: It maybe. You know I mean there were water wings when I was a kid, right, and I think as popular as they are, I think there’s a wave of people realizing how bad they are you know. I think because the people who don’t like them are so anti puddle jumpers so it’s you know in every organization like from from the NDPA to you guys, to Josh the Otter, to Collin’s, everyone universally agrees that these things are bad, right. So because of Facebook and social media I think a lot more parents than 20 years ago realize that these things are no no, you know.

Darlene Haskins: You just– you have to and I try to explain but I had to have a parent there listening to actually get across, but I actually thought about doing like a before and after. So I had a mom that knew about me, her friends took my lessons with their kids whenever, and she still wasn’t coming but she was kind of starting to think about it, and then I said, “hey, you come you bring your two kids, I’m going to put them in the water and we’re going to let them swim because I always wear puddle jumpers”, and I said. The little boy that’s four said he could swim, he’s like, “I could swim” and I was, “okay well let’s get your puddle jumper off and let’s swim to the wall”, and we videoed him. And of course he went straight under and just treaded and was under water. So I picked him up and we had a talk and he’s like “I can’t swim” and I’m like “no you can’t swim”, but he thought he could, you know he didn’t realize that the puddle jumper was actually keeping him up. So mom was shocked, he was shocked, everybody was shock. She was in on that lessons the next week, and now he swims and floats all over the place and doesn’t touch the floaty anymore. But it took that realization, she had to see it, a mom had to see that this is what’s going to happen if your child gets in the water, he has no skills, he has no breath control, no understanding of his own buoyancy, he’s treading because he’s been in the puddle jumper and just doing the tiny movements and now he’s repeating that, because that’s all he knows. So yeah, now he swims all over. His two-year-old brother was the same way, so went under water, didn’t do anything, and now he’s swimming; both of them swim and float all over the place, and the mom couldn’t be happier. So it was nice to bring that in and now we have like a before and after. So but she had to see that, she wasn’t going to enroll and then when she saw that she’s like okay, I need to enroll.

Eric Lupton: Right. That make sense.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. So I wish I wish parents could see that if they saw that, they would absolutely enroll. You have to skill the child, on top of the supervision, the fence gates, alarms, in case they make it to the water. But some people like you said many times parents think, well I watch my kid it’s not going to happen on my watch you know. We all have jobs, we all have to cook, we all have a lot of them have multiple kids, I had four kids so I totally get it. And we all try our best it’s not like we try to lose them or you know they just get out. I had my son who is 20 now, I lost him at a Six Flags and that sucked for about 15 minutes, but I about died. And the same thing I was looking at a map, we were just wandering around, and I looked at a map for a second and then I go I look down, I pull the map up, and I’m like okay we’re going to go. And then I’m looking and he’s gone, and I’m like looking. There’s a million people who are panicking, I have no idea which way to go and then I’m thinking he’s been kidnapped, he’s going to get killed you know whatever something’s happened to him. So that was a very horrible 15 minutes, but it’s like that. After that we did the little leashes which you know he’s 20. So when I did the leashes people thought that was abuse back in the day. Now there’re cute little you know bunny backpacks leash things or whatever. Well I had like a Sesame Street like harness leash thing so. And then I had four kids so I ended up sometimes if I took them all out I had them all four on leashes, and I would get all kinds of comments, but I’m like well I know where my kids are, I know they’re not like just going to wander off because they’re attached to me. So I didn’t care because losing them one time…

Eric Lupton: That’s enough.

Darlene Haskins: Was enough. I was like I don’t care. So I’ve seen cute little things now or like the little shoes squeak, or they’ve got bells on their shoes or something, so when they’re walking away you can hear them walking away, so I like those. So yeah, but that was you know fun so.

Eric Lupton: So do you still put the 20-year-old on a leash, is that still…?

Darlene Haskins: No, no, I should but I don’t. So now that my kids are older I’m able to devote more time to this. So so this has definitely come at the right time definitely right.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. So I mean you said you’ve been doing it for only you know four years or so, but you’ve done a lot.

Darlene Haskins: ISR, four years for ISR. But I taught for the city pool in California and then I taught for the YMCA for a total of about 23 years before ISR.

Eric Lupton: So what made you decide to start doing ISR in particular?

Darlene Haskins: I was teaching at the Y and I had quite a few parents asked me if we taught ISR, do you offer that here whatever. And I was at that time I had no idea what ISR was, so I went and researched it. And as soon as I saw the miles video, that famous video was the first thing that popped up, I wish as soon as I saw it I knew I’m like, I have to teach this, this is absolutely amazing. So it took me about two years to actually get in the program. They don’t just take everybody, so you have to be selected, you have to go through a process and then you have to pay the fee which it’s not a little fee.

Eric Lupton: It’s pretty expensive, yeah.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. So we have to come up with you know there’s a lot to jump through, but with any business, it’s a business. So with any business you’re going to have to put an investment in. So I mean it’s– if you think about it that way you know it’s not a, it’s not a bad price actually but compared to just becoming a Y instructor or a city instructor it’s like 300 bucks, so it’s much more expensive but it’s much more details. You’re dealing with children, little children and actually teaching them skills to get to their own independence load So you, it is a much more detailed program and the cost does make sense once you actually go through it and see it all, and I’ve been doing it for four years and I can support the family on it, so it’s not…

Eric Lupton: Right it’s working.

Darlene Haskins: Not bad. But I knew that there was going to be especially in our area, there was going to be a need for scholarships. So as soon as I even train before I even trained, I knew we were going to need scholarships. So I knew when I first started that I needed to start a foundation, but it was really, I didn’t know how to really. I’ve been part of foundations and I’ve wrote grants but I’ve never started a foundation myself, so I just kind of research things. I just got it launched last year and we have about 50 volunteers which is pretty cool. So because I’m pretty passionate about what I do and everybody can see it, so everybody just kind of inspired by it, and they want to help. Now people are coming to me for, just because they hear about it and they’re like, “I got to help you, this is something we need to do”, so pretty cool what’s happened in the last four years; but we had at least five drowning deaths within 50 miles this summer. I know two of the families personally now and there might be more than that, but you don’t hear about them. I don’t know why we don’t really hear about them, but there’s a boy that just drowned about three weeks ago and his dad contacted me and wants to help the foundation. He wants to really hit on autism, his son was autistic.

Eric Lupton: And the stats for kids who drown with autism are staggering, they’re amazing.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. They’re I think they’re the highest risk, but…

Eric Lupton: It is. And it’s something close to you know over 80% of children who wander off end up drowning. I mean, it’s something ridiculous, it’s so high.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. He– that’s what he did. He got out the door and wandered around and he was in the pond of the grandparents I believe, and they were looking for him, and then they called for like a search party and found him. So he was in the water, and he had a twin, so, a four-year-old twin, but he was the only one that got out. So the four-year-old and the one-year-old should be in lessons with me if not this year, they’ll be next year. And they get– they’re going to take part of the Live Like Jake. They have a Live Like Jake scholarship that pays for that, so that’s pretty cool, I like that I like that. And I like your guys’ fence I haven’t got any yet on the fences but what’s your guys’ free fence for people…

Eric Lupton: Yeah, yeah they save a life for real.

Darlene Haskins: I did have one lady that was looking at it but she didn’t have the need for the fence so she didn’t actually end up getting it. But those are really good programs that means something.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. We try and we try and do it with Live Like Jake a lot too you know. If if Live Like Jake is donating lessons to a family then they kind of automatically qualify for the fence which so I’m hoping that Kerry starts let people know about both you know more.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. I push it out there. And this family I don’t think the parents have a pool, but the pond. I asked them if they could get the fence the pools or the con fence.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. Probably not yes.

Darlene Haskins: So I was like okay, so but yeah I think its autism and boys are the highest highest list. I don’t know why it’s boys, are they more adventurous?

Eric Lupton: Yeah boys. And they go out more. They’re a little more risk-averse or not [inaudible 48:17] to the risk all around. So yeah boys tend to drown at a higher rates than the girls, that’s been the case since I’ve been doing it for 20 years, yeah.

Darlene Haskins: That’s crazy that’s crazy. So yeah. So just getting education and then our hand-in-hand foundation does, and we actually are starting. One of the little boys that drowned here in town was seven and just had no swimming skills, and he was in the deep end. So and I don’t know, I wasn’t– I haven’t been able to specifically talk to the mom about it in detail and she’s definitely struggling with the whole thing that happened in June, but the school that he went to wants to start a pilot program. So they want to bring kids to me to learn to swim and float and whatever else, probably five and six up which is cool, because a lot of the programs I’ve seen that are attached to schools with the school curriculum, are second and up and that almost to me defeats the purpose.

Eric Lupton: Right. Because those kids who drowned, drowned before under five years old?

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. So we kind of get them a little younger. The four-year-olds, the only thing we can really do because they won’t, they can’t bus them out there’s a lot of security issues with four-year-olds I guess, so and they’re in Head Start, not actually school yet, they can give them vouchers so we can raise money for the parents to get vouchers, and the parents can bring them to ISR. Then the older children would be American Red Cross and they can be bused out, so we’re working on those details. And then once we have that pilot program ran for about a year, then we’ll bring it and show other schools and try to get a lot of the schools on board. So so we have a lot of things going on.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. You’re kind of a one-stop shop, right? You’ve got the ISR going, then you recently started doing life saver pool fence with your husband which is cool, and you’ve done you’ve done a few fences at this point right, a decent number?

Darlene Haskins: Six, seven, six, yeah.

Eric Lupton: Which isn’t bad for out of season in North Carolina

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. I was actually surprised we’ve had that many so far. That was the other thing too, like I tell parents to check Google Earth. So they don’t have a pool, I just say, they can get out of their house, and there could be a prong that you don’t know of or which, I didn’t do my own advice I figured I knew most of the pools and I don’t have young kids so I’m like same thing, I’m like oh I don’t need to worry about doing it myself. So I was out giving little hangers out – actually made some door hangers for lifesaver and then on the back is our foundation layers, so it’s all about educating as well – so I was giving these out and I was on Google Earth and there was probably 50 pools which people are always telling me, we don’t have that many pools or that much water in North Carolina.

Eric Lupton: Yeah Malarkey.

Darlene Haskins: Not compared to Florida. In two miles there was 50 pools which really did shock me. And then the one thing that really shocked me was we have a lake within two miles and I didn’t know that it’s like a big big pond but it’s called Walker’s Lake on the Google Earth. And it’s when we were driving past that area there was like nine houses right on it, and then on the other side there was like eight. So right in their backyard is this big huge pond think, or Lake, I guess, but I just like, I’ve been here for nine years and I had no idea that huge body of water was right there. I was very shocked myself. I’m like okay, now it’s very important you need to, like parents probably have no idea that that’s there. I have no idea that that was there, so that’s eye-opening if you really think about it, you don’t even know you should look there, if your kid lives anywhere near there, he could wander over to that area.

Eric Lupton: Plus the 50 pools.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah and the 50 pools which I was very shocked that we had that many pools, but.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. I mean if you only focused on doing pools within a two mile radius that would keep you busy doing pool fences for a year, you know?

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. Yeah. So we did– we got, it’s kind of time-consuming to get those door hangers out but they get a bunch out.

Eric Lupton: We used to do a door hanger every time we installed a fence we would do one for the next-door neighbors and across the street. And the door hanger said we just made your neighbor’s pool safer, you know asked them about their pool fence. Those are cool.

Darlene Haskins: So yeah I [inaudible 52:49] I figured I would target the pools like whoever had a pool.

Eric Lupton: That works. But my brother did that. He had a pool service and he drove around with his girlfriend, you know she had the Google earth out and he would go put a door hanger on every house in the neighborhood that had a pool for his pool service. It worked really well for him he literally started a whole business from door hangers, so.

Darlene Haskins: I think I think having the safe swimming see and all the families because we have over a thousand families that is in itself is marketing, so we haven’t done too too bad. So I think next year it’s going to be [inaudible 53:25] a little bit, but right now we don’t have money because it is going into the slow season so, but we knew that going in, so we’re just kind of going to like different networking events and whatever, so.

Eric Lupton: And it seems like William and your son seemed to enjoy installing it?

Darlene Haskins: Yes. And my son is a carpenter so he is very very very handy and he’s ADHD, so he’s very like hyper, so he’s all over drilling everything and he has to make sure everything’s perfect. So he’s a good worker, he’s a good worker for it.  But yeah, so three of the fences were families that I already have and then three more were just people that have contacted us or our website or [inaudible 54:13] yeah. So we have the like the CRM that you guys helped set up. We have that set up, so everything’s ready administration wise to handle a load when we get it. I’m hoping next year I’m pretty sure next year is going to be bigger so but say oh.

Eric Lupton: [inaudible 54:31] having the more pools you can fence off the safer North Carolina is right?

Darlene Haskins: Well and I was talking to a realtor because we were looking at building a facility or buying one and up-fitting it next year the year after for swimming, we’re going to do swimming and Cross-Fit actually, so we’re looking at a partnership right now. But the realtor was asking me about the fences – my husband and I were both there – and like how are they different? Like he’s like is it a specialty fence or why if you can just sell fences, I mean it must be good. So we explained like it’s the mesh and not like a lot of the ones you see around the pools that are going to be wrought iron or wood, but usually I see wrought iron, but I’m like you kid– your kids can just climb right through wrought iron. And so you had– I mean the mesh is unclimbable, and then there’s all the safety features with the latch and the keying. I like the way you can’t stand on that whole piece…

Eric Lupton: Oh Yeah. Yeah. The hinge has a 45 degree.

Darlene Haskins: Yep. So I did a video on it, and I get kind of nervous on doing them, but I did the video and I forgot like three things. I was like, “dang it”, but it did, it was a pretty good video, unlike the gate and the little hooks.

Eric Lupton: I Liked the video it was, it’s good. Yeah.

Darlene Haskins: So I had like how you used the hooks and the little solar light. I was – actually when my husband turned the camera around after showing the fence – I was going to talk about the mesh and show the mesh and then like how the poles are removable and this and that, but I totally like spaced and like okay, we’re done. So I have to do another video but a lot of people liked it and shared it.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. I know it’s a good video and yeah I mean the difference between the wrought iron and the pool fence like the life saver pool fence is is not the wrought irons vault, wrought iron isn’t designed to be a safety fence, right you know, and that’s that’s the big difference is the life saver pool fence is specifically designed for one purpose and that’s to keep kids under five years old from getting to the pool. So everything about it is made with that in mind, the mesh, the way that you can’t lift it out the ground, the way that the moldings are sanded down so there’s no sharp edges, the slip cap on the hinges, the the latch that’s way up high, the key lockable, you know everything about it is designed to keep kids out. So you know that that makes a big difference when it’s designed with that purpose in mind.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. So people here don’t understand that difference because they’ve never really thought about having a safety fence so they’re like, why is it different than a [inaudible 57:06] you know. So I have to explain that stuff so or a lot of families that have a pool think that because their yard is fenced they’re fine, but that’s it like I’m like, it’s not, that’s not all of it.

Eric Lupton: That’s good, that’s good for your neighbors.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah like it’s to protect you.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. Your neighbor’s kids are great, your kids not so much, you know.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. Yeah. So there’s a few families that I know that really need one but it’s ugly I know one of them is. They think it’s ugly so they won’t do it. But I was like well, so yeah, so there’s a fence and I know Paul [inaudible 57:47] would get kind of upset if he saw the picture, but I took a picture of a house about a mile I guess from me, and it has an above-ground pool and it’s right on like the side of their house, but no fence at all. And we live in an older neighborhood with older kids but there’s going to be grandkids, there’s going to be cousins, people are going to come over. So I every time I’m jogging by I’m like, uh-uh-uh. So I need to stop by and throw door hanger on their door, but…

Eric Lupton: Yeah for sure.

Darlene Haskins: But there’s no fence at all, nothing.

Eric Lupton: That’s so crazy.

Darlene Haskins: So like okay, and I I didn’t know if we had a law in North Carolina and I’ve asked to talk to Marsha Kerr I think her name is about it. And there there is a law but it’s not actually when I was looking for it, it wasn’t under like North Carolina laws, like you just government law, it was under building codes. So it’s actually as you build your house there’s a code for pool fences and it’s either or you can do alarms or a fence, not both. They don’t have to do both, but it does say a four-sided enclosure.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. I know our former dealer in North Carolina fought really hard to get that in there, so.

Darlene Haskins: Oh good. Okay. It was passed in 2010 or 12 I think.

Eric Lupton: Yeah. I think you know that’s probably about what he finished you know, but…

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. I don’t think it’s like fully enforced though.

Eric Lupton: Probably.

Darlene Haskins: But yeah. But it is there and it doesn’t do retroactive so anybody before that date doesn’t have to adhere to it.

Eric Lupton: [inaudible 59:28] Yeah Marsha crew Marsha crew is great. Her and her then husband Bill Kerr were our first-ever lifesaver pool fence dealers back in 1991 in California. And yeah, they’re great people, so.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. I met her daughter that’s how I met her. Her daughter was at the training with us so. And then she said her mom was the one that got the signs on the bucket like they said, don’t let your you know bucket safety, I was like, oh that’s pretty cool. So we talk here and there, she’s pretty cool. We were trying to get an association going here like because of Braden did in South Carolina. It’s a process to get these things going so eventually we’ll have one.  We just have to have a lot more people think that this is important around here, and we are getting there. But it’s been four years, so it’s like looking back. It’s we’ve made a lot of progress but we still have a lot of progress to make, so we’ll still keep doing. I’m pretty persistent so it’ll happen, just kind of convince people that this is important.

Eric Lupton: Well you’re doing– I mean you’re doing really good work between the nonprofit, you know the stuff you’re doing in Africa is fantastic, the pool fences obviously I’m a fan of, and the swim lessons. I think you’re checking all the boxes. So you know I’m sure that you know there’s people alive that wouldn’t be right now you know which is, it’s a cool thing to think about you know.

Darlene Haskins: Yeah. Yeah. So we have, and I have lessons in like 30 minutes so I better run, but…

Eric Lupton: Yes I was going to say is there anything you want let people know before we wrap up here?

Darlene Haskins: No. You can check out our website hand-in-hand water safety dot org; it’s our main website. And then definitely check out parents preventing childhood drowning and then I like to, well what is that– well the families united that is good, I like that resource. And then just all the different programs. I just follow it to the programs and just I try to get the most current useful statistical information out there so I have facts to give my families, so we don’t put anything on our site or on Facebook unless we’ve really researched it and made sure this is correct information, so but yeah, definitely the website for sure.

Eric Lupton: Perfect.

Darlene Haskins: Okay.

Eric Lupton: Well thank you so much.

Darlene Haskins: You’re welcome.

Eric Lupton: All right enjoy your lessons, have a great day. Goodbye everyone!

Darlene Haskins: Bye.